The following is a transcript of an interview with Republican Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, which aired on Sunday, February 7, 2021, on “Face the Nation”.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We want to go now to Senator Lindsey Graham in Clemson, South Carolina. Good morning to you, Senator.
SENATOR LINDSEY GRAHAM: Good morning. Thanks for receiving me.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Iran has threatened to expel UN inspectors in the next three weeks if sanctions are not lifted. You heard the president. Where do you think the impasse will go from here?
SEN. GRAHAM: Well, the Trump administration put Iran in a box. As a result, you have four or five Arab nations making peace deals with Israel. I think Iran is weaker today than it has been since the regime was started some 40 years ago. So if I were President Biden, I would maintain sanctions until Iran changes its behavior. I would not like to enter into an old agreement with Iran because they have not been doing anything good for a long time. So he will have three problems here: what to do with Iran differently than Trump, what to do with China differently than Trump, and how to change Trump’s immigration policies without creating a border race. I would warn President Biden because Trump did that, it doesn’t mean I’m wrong. So I would slow down if I were President Biden and reevaluate some of these Trump policies and keep them in place if they made sense.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You have known the Biden family for years. Have you spoken to the president since taking office?
SEN. GRAHAM: No, I don’t. Congratulations to- for him. He is the legitimate president. I spoke to Secretary Blinken two days ago. I am very satisfied with what the Biden government is proposing for Afghanistan. We will keep troops there in a condition-based approach. The Afghan study group –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Last May?
SEN. GRAHAM: – did you say goodbye again?
MARGARET BRENNAN: Last May, which is when the Trump deal would require a reduction based on conditions?
SEN. GRAHAM: I think- I think it was, yes, I think we are not leaving in May. We will leave when conditions are right. The … the Taliban is cheating. They are not obeying. And I like what Tony Blinken and the Biden administration are doing. They are reevaluating our presence in Afghanistan to keep the footprint low, but not to go away and lose all the gains we have made. If we leave too early without a withdrawal based on conditions, ISIS and al-Qaeda will return in full force. Women will suffer a lot. So they are in a good place, I think, in Afghanistan. When it comes to Iran, I would like to warn the Biden government to return to the Iranian agreement. There is a proposal from me and Senator Menendez that Iranians can have all the nuclear energy they want. They just can’t get rich. And I think the Arabs would do this business, which would be a good deal for the world.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, we’ll be on the lookout for the policy. I want to ask you what’s going on here at home with the scheduled trial that is due to begin on Tuesday for former President Donald Trump. You voted against this trial, but you said it the morning after the Capitol siege.
(BEGIN CLIP)
SEN. GRAHAM: When it comes to accountability, the president needs to understand that his actions were the problem, not the solution, that yesterday’s rally was inappropriate. This got out of hand. It breaks my heart that my friend, an important president, allowed yesterday to happen. And it will be an important part of your presidency. It was a self-inflicted wound. It was going too far.
(CLIP END)
MARGARET BRENNAN: What has changed?
SEN. GRAHAM: Well, it is not a crime. I mean, the Chamber is impeaching on the theory that his speech has created a stir. When you look at the facts, a lot of people already planned to – to attack the Capitol before it spoke.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, the trial memorandum of …
SEN. GRAHAM: The president said at the rally that I think …
MARGARET BRENNAN: The memorandum of judgment by the Chamber’s impeachment managers actually sets a pattern of behavior. They say it was not just the speech. They say it was cultivated over time.
SEN. GRAHAM: Yes, well, here’s what I would say: if you believe you have committed a crime, it can be prosecuted just like any other citizen. Impeachment is a political process. We never accuse a president after he left office. I think it’s a bad idea. More than forty-five Republicans will vote first, which is unconstitutional. It is not a question of how the trial ends. It is a matter of when it ends. Republicans will see this as an unconstitutional exercise. And the only question is, are they going to call witnesses? How long does the test take? But the result is not really in doubt. This does not mean that what happened on January 6 was good. This means that this impeachment, in the eyes of most Republicans, is an unconstitutional exercise.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
SEN. GRAHAM: The president’s behavior, in my opinion, is not a crime, but he can be accused if people think he did it, because now he is an ordinary citizen.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, some Republicans, his colleague, Pat Toomey, a Republican, believe that this is constitutional, since the president was impeached while still in office. But, you know, people can look at it and say, look, when you can’t argue a case on its merits, you argue in the process. And that is what the Republicans are doing now. Because I want to ask you to clarify this. You said on January 7th, that about Mike Pence.
(BEGIN CLIP)
SEN. GRAHAM: The things that he was – that he was asked to do in the name of loyalty were exaggerated, unconstitutional, illegal and would have been wrong for the country.
(CLIP END)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Unconstitutional and illegal sounds a lot like serious crimes and misdemeanors.
SEN. GRAHAM: Yes, well, he was not accused of that. The bottom line is that the impeachment articles, I think, are unconstitutional because the president is in Florida. He’s not in charge. The impeachment of a president requires the president of the court to preside over the trial. He’s not on trial because President Trump is not the president. Therefore, this is not a process. The Constitution, I think, is being flagrantly violated because, when it comes to Trump, there seems to be no end to all of this. Therefore, the trial will result in acquittal. Most Republicans, I don’t know what Senator Toomey is going to do, will see this as unconstitutional and the president’s behavior is not an incitement under the law. And the longer it takes, the worse for the country, I believe.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You said that if the president committed a crime, he should be charged. Do you think any of the president’s actions, the tweets asking for the rally, the language that led him, the lie to the public about the ability to overturn the election, what you described he said about Mike Pence, does any of these things deserve a reprimand?
SEN. GRAHAM: Well, I mean, it will have a place in history for all of this, but the point of the matter is that we are in Congress. We are not prosecutors. Impeachment was never meant to be an accusation.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right, but you oversaw the Department of Justice.
SEN. GRAHAM: We don’t make a list of directors.
MARGARET BRENNAN: What do you think?
SEN. GRAHAM: Yes, I think I am ready to move on. I am ready to end the impeachment trial because I think it is blatantly unconstitutional. I am ready to continue trying to solve the nation’s problems. And as for Donald Trump, he is the most popular figure in the Republican Party. He had a consequent presidency. January 6 was a very bad day for America, and he will have his share of guilt in history. But I believe that in 2022, the Republican Party will come back roaring because our friends from the Democratic Party – on the Democratic side will change immigration policy to have caravans after caravans reach our borders.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So you still believe that he is the head of the Republican Party?
SEN. GRAHAM: They will increase our taxes and weaken us in all areas. Excuse me again? I’m so sorry.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Do you still believe that President Trump is the best face for the Republican Party? Yes or no?
SEN. GRAHAM: I think he- I think he’s o- yes, I think, yes. I think … I think Donald Trump’s policies have served the country well. I think Donald Trump has to rehabilitate –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
SEN. GRAHAM: – even as a politician. But here’s what I think. I think–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Wait–
SEN. GRAHAM: – most Americans will look –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Senator–
SEN. GRAHAM: –in the Biden administration and–
MARGARET BRENNAN: I’m sorry, we’re out of time.
SEN. GRAHAM: Sorry, go ahead.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I’m sorry here …
SEN. GRAHAM: Okay.
MARGARET BRENNAN: – cut you, I have to take us for a commercial break. Thank you for your time this morning. Stay with us.