White House lawyer Pat Cipollone and another lawyer who represented Trump in his first impeachment trial, Eric Herschmann, offered the serious warnings while Trump, his daughter Ivanka and her husband Jared Kushner listened. Other lawyers joined by phone. Everyone told Trump that he should not forgive himself, his family or any Republican lawmaker prospectively, unless he was prepared to list specific crimes.
Cipollone and former attorney general William Barr warned Trump earlier this month that they did not believe he should forgive himself, several sources familiar with the matter told CNN last week. Barr conveyed this position to Trump before resigning last month, sources say.
Trump continued to bring the issue up for the next few days, even after officials believed the issue was resolved. But the serious meeting on Saturday night at the White House seemed to put the idea aside.
While Trump often dismisses advice he doesn’t agree with – particularly from Cipollone, with whom he has a fractured relationship – Saturday’s message resonated. The conversation scared Trump in a way that few did, said a person familiar with his reaction to CNN.
His final batch of pardons, scheduled for Tuesday, is expected to contain few of the controversial or strange criminals who characterized his earlier use of his clemency powers.
Trump may still change his mind and retain his broad powers of clemency until noon on Wednesday. The president continues to bring pardons that advisers previously thought were out of the question, including for ex-strategist Steve Bannon, leading to general uncertainty about whether Trump will continue to follow his lawyers’ advice.
But White House officials and others familiar with the matter describe a dumb president, concerned about his pending impeachment trial and revolving legal problems, who was deterred from his long-discussed ideas after the Capitol insurrection.
Several Republican lawmakers who allegedly were involved in the rally that preceded the deadly US Capitol riot called for Trump’s clemency before he stepped down, but after meeting with his legal advisers for several hours on Saturday, the president decided not to grant it. them, according to two people familiar with their plans.
The fear of legal exposure is not limited to Republicans who promoted or spoke at the rally, including representatives Andy Biggs, Mo Brooks and Paul Gosar. Those who participated, organized and raised funds are also concerned, sources told CNN, including their eldest son, Donald Trump Jr. and his girlfriend Kimberly Guilfoyle, who spoke at the rally.
The main figures associated with the groups that helped organize it – including Women for America First and Turning Point Action, the arm of Turning Point USA’s political action committee – also expressed private concern about the legal repercussions, a known person told CNN .
Several of Trump’s closest advisers also asked him not to grant clemency to anyone who violated the United States Capitol, despite Trump’s initial position that those involved did nothing wrong.
The idea of forgiving himself captivated Trump almost the entire term of his presidency. He saw the prospect as a one-sided magic wand that he believed could alleviate his legal problems, if not make them disappear completely.
Almost as attractive: preventive leniency for his family members, which Trump has long regretted being unfairly targeted by his enemies. Making them immune to retribution seemed like a raised middle finger to their detractors.
The legal situation of any of the movements was questionable, and Cipollone was “straightforward and strong” that self-forgiveness would hardly take to court, said a person familiar with the matter. Internally, one of the items in Cipollone’s legacy is believed to be if he dissuades Trump from forgiving himself.
Others appealed to Trump, warning that he should be more concerned with the effect this would have on his legacy, not with the legal situation of pardons.
The decision not to forgive any Republican lawmakers or members of their family was a last minute one. After initially defending the idea that he can forgive himself or his family for fear that they will be targeted once he leaves office, Trump decided on Saturday night that he would not forgive anyone in his family or himself. same.
Trump agreed with lawyers and other consultants that it would increase the appearance of guilt and could make them more vulnerable, but he was disappointed with the result, according to people familiar with the matter.
Trump, according to the people he spoke to, seemed more interested in the message of uncontrolled power that he could send to his opponents than in real protection against responsibility. His forgiving power was among his favorite work advantages.
Trump will step down in the face of significant legal issues that only increased during his last days in office. His phone call to the Georgia secretary of state, asking him to “find” votes, and his speech encouraging his crowd to “show strength” on their march to the Capitol, placed him under a legal microscope.
The new possible criminal exposure comes at the top of New York State’s ongoing investigations into the president’s finances and several defamation lawsuits related to Trump denying accusations of sexual assault by women. The Manhattan district attorney’s office has a broad criminal investigation to investigate allegations of insurance fraud and tax fraud. The New York attorney general has a civil investigation into whether the Trump Organization has unduly inflated the value of its assets.
The large legal deposit that the president now enters provided an imminent backdrop for his ongoing discussion of pardons, which began in earnest last year.
In recent weeks, Trump has argued endlessly about pardons with his associates, often asking whether people who had not been charged with a crime wanted to have one before he stepped down. The discussions unnerved some advisers, who did not believe they were in line for a lawsuit.
Even on Monday, with hours remaining in his presidency, Trump seemed obsessed with pardons.
While he was considering preventive pardons for his children and his personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani, a source close to the lawsuit said they are no longer expected. Bannon, who was indicted for fraud, is also unlikely to receive pardon on Tuesday, the source said.
Trump also must not forgive Edward Snowden or Julian Assange, whose roles in the disclosure of U.S. secrets infuriated official Washington.
Although he once considered the idea, Trump decided against it because he did not want to anger the Senate Republicans, who will soon determine whether he was convicted during his Senate trial. Several Republican lawmakers sent messages through advisers who believed strongly in not granting clement to Assange or Snowden.
Upon leaving office, Trump expressed real concern that Republicans could turn against him. A conviction in the Senate’s impeachment trial would limit his future political activities and deprive him of some of the government’s advantages of being a former president.
Trump is less concerned about being prevented from stepping out of office again and more concerned about the prospect of being condemned by the Senate, people familiar with the matter said.