“The vice president has the power to reject fraudulently chosen voters,” Trump declared falsely on Tuesday, giving credence to an erroneous theory that Pence could override the election results during the counting of the Electoral College votes on Wednesday and pressuring its main lieutenant again to act outside constitutional limits.
His message came the next morning after Trump woke up a crowd of supporters in Georgia using Pence’s next appointment on the Senate floor.
“I hope Mike Pence shows up for us, I have to tell you,” Trump said Monday night during a political rally in Georgia, where his public crowd was met with applause. “Of course, if he doesn’t pass, I won’t like him that much.”
It was a direct message to a vice president whose defining political characteristics remain his unyielding allegiance to Trump. The way Pence proceeds on Wednesday, when he presides over the Electoral College’s counting certification, can determine his future relationship with the man he served loyally, even in times of political danger.
The two had lunch together on Tuesday, according to two sources. Their lunches are normally placed on their public calendars, but were not listed on Tuesday.
Pence and White House advisers tried to explain to him that Pence’s role is more of a formality and that he cannot unilaterally reject the votes of the Electoral College. Pence guided Trump in his largely procedural role in the hope of minimizing pressure on him, a strategy that does not seem to have worked, as the president explicitly urged him to act on Monday night without saying exactly what he wanted Pence to do.
There is little expectation among advisers to Trump or Pence that he will deviate from his role prescribed by the constitution.
“He will follow the law and the constitution,” said a person familiar with the matter.
Relentless, Trump still seems interested in the idea and has not given up asking Pence how he could somehow reverse or prevent Biden from being certified as a winner, according to people familiar with the talks.
“He is a wonderful and intelligent man and a man I like very much, but he will have a lot to say about it,” Trump said on Monday. “You know something with him. You’ll be able to make things right. He gets to the point.”
Procedure
Traditionally, the vice president presides over the certification of the electoral vote, although it is not a requirement. In 1969, then Vice President Hubert Humphrey did not preside over the process, as he had just lost the presidential election to Richard Nixon. The Senate pro tempore president presided in his place.
A source close to Pence said it is not seen as a good fit for Republican Senator Chuck Grassley – the current pro tempore president – to be there instead of Pence on January 6.
Pence and Trump were seen meeting in the Oval Office on Monday, along with White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and Trump’s daughter Ivanka Trump before Trump left for Georgia. According to Trump’s personal lawyer, Rudy Giuliani, the pair were to discuss how to proceed on January 6.
“That decision must be made by the president and the vice president, and they are going to meet today and go through all the research – they probably are not going to make that decision tomorrow,” said Giuliani in a podcast hosted by Charlie Kirk, a conservative activist.
Giuliani pointed out several issues that he characterized as constitutional issues that he said Pence and Trump would discuss. He framed the decision for both Trump and Pence – although the president made it clear that he believes Pence should somehow act to prevent certification, and Pence, in particular, explained that his role is purely ceremonial.
On Sunday, Pence met for a long session with Senate parliamentarian Elizabeth MacDonough in his office near the Senate floor. Pence’s chief of staff, Marc Short, who was also on Capitol Hill and was seen at one point entering the office of Senate majority leader Mitch McConnell, denied that the purpose of the meeting was to find a way to overturn the results of the College. Electoral.
“No,” said Short. “We are just meeting.”
Asked why he was meeting with the congressman, Short said they were “trying to find out the exact process”.
Presidential outrage
Still, procedure and process can hardly neutralize Pence from the outrage of a president who still believes the election was stolen from him and has fueled conspiracies about the results of a group of marginal advisers.
Just this weekend, Trump’s commercial adviser Peter Navarro said on Fox News that Pence had the power to delay Induction Day, contradicting the constitution.
Last month, Trump offered tacit approval for the lawsuit filed by his Republican ally, Rep. Louie Gohmert, pressing Pence to overturn the election results and was later disappointed to learn that his own Justice Department was asking a judge to reject the action, according to a person familiar with the matter. Trump and Pence discussed the matter late last week.
For weeks, Trump told associates that he doesn’t believe Pence is fighting hard enough for him. This frustration is, in part, what prompted Pence’s chief of staff to issue a statement on Saturday night, saying that he welcomed Congress’ efforts to raise objections to the Electoral College, although several noted that it looked carefully drafted and did not say that he supported the objections openly.
“Vice President Pence shares the concerns of millions of Americans about voter fraud and irregularities in the last election,” wrote Short. “The vice president appreciates the efforts of members of the House and Senate to use the authority they have under the law to raise objections and present evidence before Congress and the American people on January 6.”
Speaking at his own rally in Georgia on Monday, Pence offered little insight into his thinking on January 6, even when he reinforced Trump’s false claims about electoral fraud.
Instead, he kept his comments vague.
“I know we all have our doubts about the last election,” he said. “I want to assure you, I share the concerns of millions of Americans about voting irregularities. I promise you, come this Wednesday, we will have our day in Congress, we will hear the objections, we will hear the evidence. “
Pence did not say what happens next.
CNN’s Kaitlan Collins and Pamela Brown contributed to this report.