PARIS – President Emmanuel Macron of France said in an interview on Friday that for Europe to be a reliable partner for the United States, it would also have to be “an autonomous partner” with its own military and technological capabilities, because “cooperation it cannot be dependency ”.
Speaking to a dozen foreign correspondents, Macron said he had a long telephone conversation last Sunday with President Joseph R. Biden Jr., in which he explained his thoughts on NATO’s future.
“It is not that we want to break up existing alliances or partnerships,” he said. But, he continued, “Cooperating is choosing to work together for shared values and goals. The day that cooperation becomes addiction, you will become someone’s vassal and disappear. “
The unreliability of former President Donald J. Trump’s administration and his persistent criticisms of NATO and the European Union have accelerated a European strategic reassessment. Mr. Macron has been the most direct voice of the European Union, asking for investments in European military equipment more developed together and deploring the bloc’s technological dependence, whether from China or, as he said, “even from an ally like the United States. United”.
Regarding his conversation with Biden, the French president said: “I told him that we defend European strategic autonomy because Europe must shoulder its share of the burden.” The exchange was “very pleasant and pleasant,” said Macron, ending with an agreement to work together.
Other European countries, including Germany, have been cautious in using the word “autonomy”. The French president faces an election next year, and a stance that affirms French and European sovereignty is likely to work well in the center-right of the political spectrum, an important potential constituency for him. It also reflects deep personal beliefs that Mr. Macron has expressed since 2017.
Looking relaxed in his black turtleneck shirt and blue suit, his watch and a small watch on the table in front of him, Mr. Macron spoke with exhaustive lucidity for more than an hour and a half on a variety of subjects, including threats to democracy , the pandemic, Brexit and the relationship between France and its large Muslim population, sometimes marginalized.
In turn, philosophical and pragmatic, always intense, the president interspersed his arguments with broad reflections, such as: “You know, you cannot dominate the course of history, but you can try to find its guiding thread”.
One such topic, suggested Macron, alluding to the January 6 attack on the United States Capitol, was the increase in violence that has become a direct threat to democracies.
Without “the ability to respect individual freedoms and create a framework for peaceful debate”, democratic societies faced collapse, he said. But some people, in France as in America, concluded that “there is so much economic, social or other violence that physical violence on the streets is justified. I believe that this is a profound error that threatens democracy. “
Social media, he said, brought about a kind of “anthropological mutation” characterized by “fascination with hate”. At the same time, democracies are experiencing a “leveling that destroys the principle of authority”, without which they cannot function effectively.
These developments raised the urgent issue of regulating large private social media companies. “I am not in favor of delegating to private companies, because of their prominence, the right to decide about my life and our life in a democracy,” said Macron.
Turning to the pandemic, which led to the imposition of a 6 pm curfew in France, and stricter border restrictions announced on Friday, and growing discontent among a population tired of restrictions, blockades and deprivations, Mr Macron said: “It is normal that there are effects of tiredness, impatience, moments of tension in the question of vaccines”.
But he defended Europe’s Covid-19 strategy, arguing that it would be unrealistic to compare the European continent open to island nations like New Zealand, which largely eliminated the virus, or to smaller countries like Israel, where vaccination rates exceeded those in Europe.
“All of this only works if we do it together,” said Macron of the European Union’s approach to vaccination, adding that it was a “rational strategy” to get the European Commission to buy a variety of vaccines for the entire bloc. He said the United States “completely failed” to deal with the first phase of the pandemic, but was doing well now because it had invested heavily in vaccines to “accelerate” its development.
“How do you do good science as quickly as possible? The Americans showed it very well, ”said Macron. “Much better than us.”
Paying attention to the theme of entrepreneurial initiative – one of the foundations of his attempt to reform France, even if he is increasingly moderated by talking about the importance of the state – Macron attributed the American successes to “a model of organization less risk-averse”.
Regarding Europeans, he suggested: “Maybe we were a little too cautious at times, sometimes we were too meticulous”, although he emphasized that it was important to find the right balance and not “abandon precautions”.
Balance has been an important topic in Mr. Macron’s presidency, as he sought to combine the liberation of the economy with the preservation of France’s social model. This has led to suggestions that he tries to reconcile the irreconcilable in a style of constant governance, on the one hand, on the other.
In the face of the pandemic, he said, it was inevitable that protecting people would take precedence over free market reform. He promised never to falter in his “whatever the cost” approach to Covid-19 – leaving the debt issue accumulated for a while after the virus was defeated.
Brexit, he said, was a “mistake” based on “many lies”, a sovereign decision that he respected, but that would complicate many things.
“I believe in continental sovereignty, I believe in nation states and not in neo-nationalism,” said Macron. “So I am in favor of a shared ambition and finding a common destination again, and I hope that Boris Johnson and those around him will share that path.”
On tensions in France caused by Islamic terrorism, including three attacks in the second half of last year, and his own attempts to root out his roots and achieve better integration of the country’s Muslim citizens, Macron said:
“I never said that I want moderate Muslims. That’s not my problem. I do not ask a Catholic to be moderate. I do not care. When it comes to someone’s religion, it doesn’t concern me. On the other hand, I demand that every citizen, whatever his religion, respect the rules of the Republic, because he is a citizen before being a believer or an unbeliever ”.
Aurelien Breeden in Paris contributed reporting.